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  • #16
    The BB with the most options

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Reeve of Shinra
      Some specific items that I praise vb on over the competition would be:

      - Very robust template / css system

      - Phrasing system - I use it for alot of things, like my disclaimer. Its easier than having it in the template and I can use it in alot of places without having to make twenty didfferent edits!

      - Data cacheing... omg, you have no idea how good this is when you have a decent sized site!


      I registered on these forums tonight purely to ask the question that has been asked in this thread.

      Can someone explain to me exactly what those quoted terms mean please?

      I'm quite new to php stuff. I have had limited experience with phpBB forums before. I want to build a new site with forums and hopefully we will be getting alot of traffic. I want stable reliable forums that can handle alot of traffic and not be hacked. Vbulletin is obviously very good because there is only positive feedback here, so I'm leaning toward Vbulletin at the moment, but can someone please explain to me (in non computer terms) what they loved about using Vbulletin?

      Also (another really stupid question) what is a plugin?

      Thanks

      Reg (the noob)

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      • #18
        Originally posted by kodoks
        VB is good BB, but so hard to install, edit and text "powered by vbulletin"
        G D
        To edit that you edit the phase, it's not in the templates

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Reg Carter


          I registered on these forums tonight purely to ask the question that has been asked in this thread.

          Can someone explain to me exactly what those quoted terms mean please?

          I'm quite new to php stuff. I have had limited experience with phpBB forums before. I want to build a new site with forums and hopefully we will be getting alot of traffic. I want stable reliable forums that can handle alot of traffic and not be hacked. Vbulletin is obviously very good because there is only positive feedback here, so I'm leaning toward Vbulletin at the moment, but can someone please explain to me (in non computer terms) what they loved about using Vbulletin?

          Also (another really stupid question) what is a plugin?

          Thanks

          Reg (the noob)
          Ease of use, I started using vB (as an administrator) at 16 and found it easy and not complex. I didn't have to spend hours adding features not found in most other message boards. And the community is friendly and helpful

          Comment


          • #20
            I've tinkered with Open-Source, it's all considered Retro when you've tried vB. Any vB Client would know that. I started mine under a month ago, and I already have 17-18 members, soon to rise.
            -- David.

            If I spend much more time browsing these forums, I could be subjected to: 1. Burnt retinas, 2. Angry customers, 3. Lack of moderation, 4. Arguments.
            This used to be a nice place; what the hell's gone wrong?

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            • #21
              I don't have much time to explain, but I used extensively PHPbb (which is good) and made some mods and skins for it.

              Then I moved to IPB and made skins and hacks for it (for my purposes) which was also good but not good enough (has a high resource usage) and then I moved to vBulletin.... (speechless) I just can't use any other forum software right now.

              Its the best because of many many things (especially after version 3.5.0).

              - The code is very well optimized, which makes it less resourse intensive than most others.
              - Fantastic support
              - Easy to skin (ok most of you won't think that way)
              - Has AJAX which makes some little things like post edit and quick reply being doable without page reloading
              - Strong moderations / admin option

              The only downside is
              - the original vBulletin Skin look sucks a lot. I mean its horrible (in my opininion) and the icons used are also not my type of icons I like.

              http://www.portcraft.com/forum

              This is a vBulletin 3.5.0 installation with non vbulletin icons / look.


              Note: anyways remember that you buy the code (which is worth every cent of it), not the look.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Vtec44
                Like you said, most top sites use vBulletin, so most likely that a regular Internet user is familiar with the interface. Familiar and easy to use interface can attract users. That was the reason why I picked vB over other other scripts. In addition to that, vB is has a clean interface, extremely flexible, and proven real world reliability. Oh, the support is awesome when you need it.

                PS, I'm wating for whitetigergrowl to post his opinion and claim it as fact. LOL
                Which is exactly what you are doing. In my experiences with VB, the plug-in system needs serious help. The admin cp is just one long scroll down list, especially if you have other mods with control panels, and is poorly laid out IMO. When you have plug-ins that have control panels, 9 out of 10 times they end up at the top of the admin cp, and push down the default VB options. And I've had an experience where not even though the 'Product Manager', could the plug-in be uninstalled. I've also seen SQL queries jump and the server get used more intensely after installing many of the plug-ins. Some claim VB is less server intense than IPB. Some claim the same for VB. Its hard to say. But I know of a webmaster the other day that had to shut his site down because some of the plug-ins killed the server. So now he has them shut off. Which also could mean some of the plug-ins are poorly coded, are the plug-in system may be. Dunno.

                I have personal experience with both IPB (and its newest board version), as well as VB (and its newest board version.).

                It comes down to personal opinion. Just because Vtech44 claims something, it does not make it fact. Its HIS OPINION. And we don't know how experienced he is with other boards such as IPB or PHPBB. And claiming you know another board, but keep referring to an older version of it, definetly does not make you an expert. And here's a quote I found at a webmaster website that I agree 100% with:

                The way i see it, the larger the hacking community is, the worse the actual software is. If your software lacks so many features that people need to go to 3rd parties to fill that void, The software developer is doing something wrong.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Is that last quote a dig on the vbulletin coding community?

                  A forum is a forum, not a CMS.
                  A forum is a forum, not a journal system for users.
                  A forum is a forum, not a gallery for artists.
                  A forum is a forum, not a links directory.
                  A forum is a forum, not a ____________.

                  The majority of the hacks on vb.org are about making a more robust SITE something they are able to do by extending existing forum functionality. This in no way means that the actual forum itself is lacking. VB3 incorporated the majority of the enhancements users wanted to see and more. There may be one or two things members still want, but thats a given with any software.
                  Plan, Do, Check, Act!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    You can not blame vBulletin or Jelsoft for badly coded plugins (would be like blaming PHP or MySQL). Yes there are many plugins released, and some will be better coded then others. You should be aware of this as a webmaster and test modifications on a testboard first.

                    Personally i don't 100% agree with the quote you're giving. In an ideal situation this would be true. But in real life this can only be done with costum software specifically written for you as webmaster, or with software that has only a limited and clearly defined function.

                    If you create general software like Bulletin Board software, it is simply impossible to create standard software that will fit the needs of every webmaster. And even if you would try that, you would be creating a monstrum that would be very resource intensive and has more chance of bugs, simply because of the size of the source code.

                    Take default vBulletin and it will just do perfect what it is designed for: create a bulletin board.
                    Want to take your board beyond the standard vBulletin features?
                    Visit the official Member to Member support site for vBulletin Modifications: www.vbulletin.org

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Reg Carter
                      Can someone explain to me exactly what those quoted terms mean please?

                      Also (another really stupid question) what is a plugin?
                      A plugin is essentially a way to add a hack or mod without having to edit the core php files for the forum. Most of the plug-ins availabe are as simple as uploading a file to your server and clicking a few buttons to install it. This makes it a snap to upgrade since you wont have to re-edit your files. Not all hacks can be made into a plug-in but alot are being done this way.

                      - Very robust template / css system

                      Try out the admin demo if you haven't already. There is a web interface to change a good portion of how your forums looks with the css style editor. If you know a little html, you can also go into specific templates and further customize them to your needs.

                      - Phrasing system

                      Its basically a variable that displays a word or sentance. You could add that word or sentence directly to the template but a phrase is shorter and cleaner to look at and if its alot easier to change later on since you dont have to find a certain word in a template somewhere.

                      Since phrases can be used multiple times, I could have 30 custom pages that display but only have to make 1 edit to change what that phrase says.


                      - Data cacheing

                      Any site queries the database for information. Somethings however wont really change that often so Vbulletin will store that particular info in another place to speed up the site.
                      Plan, Do, Check, Act!

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                      • #26
                        Thanks Reeve

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Reeve of Shinra
                          - Data cacheing

                          Any site queries the database for information. Somethings however wont really change that often so Vbulletin will store that particular info in another place to speed up the site.
                          Explain to me how this is vb-specific, please. I may be dumb, and not aware of something new, but the only form of caching I was aware of was 1) php cache's like eaccelerator and 2) mysql query caching, which are both available to any php/mysql setup and not specific to vbulletin.

                          Thanks!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I have had a look at the admin panel and have to say that it appears very impressive. I'm definately getting VBulletin.

                            One of the first things I want to do with VBulletin is put our site banners at the top and bottom. I did a search on how to do this and found lots of discussion about third party programs etc. Are these propgrams simple to use. And to someone starting out, what would be the simplest way to do install banners?

                            Thanks

                            Reg

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by MarcoH64
                              You can not blame vBulletin or Jelsoft for badly coded plugins (would be like blaming PHP or MySQL). Yes there are many plugins released, and some will be better coded then others. You should be aware of this as a webmaster and test modifications on a testboard first.

                              Personally i don't 100% agree with the quote you're giving. In an ideal situation this would be true. But in real life this can only be done with costum software specifically written for you as webmaster, or with software that has only a limited and clearly defined function.

                              If you create general software like Bulletin Board software, it is simply impossible to create standard software that will fit the needs of every webmaster. And even if you would try that, you would be creating a monstrum that would be very resource intensive and has more chance of bugs, simply because of the size of the source code.

                              Take default vBulletin and it will just do perfect what it is designed for: create a bulletin board.
                              I never blamed VB for the plug-ins. I've even stated that in past posts. That comes down to the coders. However how the plug-in system is set-up is very poor.

                              As for testing on a test board, thats a controlled enviroment and does not reflect what will happen on a production board. Obviously you will not find out it's server load, bugs, and such until it's actually being used by numerous people in numerous conditions and enviroments.

                              Every situation is different. I have IPB 2.1.2 running on my website, along with VB 3.5 final. VB 3.5, especially with plug-ins, has added many more queries to the server and has been more server intensive than IPB 2.1.2. And they BOTH have mods attached to them. And like I said previously, the webmaster of a 'rival' website has VB 3.5 final running as his main forums. He has a few plug-ins installed. However those plug-ins caused his server to crash (and this has almost happened a few times with my site with the plug-ins), and for awhile his site was forced down and he had to strip VB 3.5 down and shut off his plug-ins in order to get things back up and running. In fact, he's looking at switching to IPB and has a poll going on for his members. Of course you'll see people make the same claims about various versions of IPB.

                              The plug-in system is only as good as the coders make it. And if they release plug-ins that crash servers, add numerous queries to the server, can't be uninstalled, etc., then people will reflect that back to VB. Even inadvertantly. On a basic level Vbulletin 3.5 is fine. However many want to add the various plug-ins, not realizing what that plug-in can do in an actual working enviroment and not a test one. Sure it might work great with a few people testing it, but then the rest of the board starts testing it and all kinds of issues pop up. I've said it once and I'll say it again, the plug-in system needs help. Great idea, poor overall execution.

                              But this isn't about IPB OR VB. It's about the fact that every situation is different. I can strip VB and IPB down to the basics or I can pimp them out. It doesn't matter. What matters is how the board handles those changes.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Sounds like the plugins you are using are either badly coded, or somthing. I have plugins running on most of my sites without any issues.

                                The plugin system itself is not going to cause any additional querys, etc, bad code does that.

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