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  • #31
    Originally posted by myusername View Post
    Greetings.

    Let me try to clear up some of the speculation and rumors. While it might not make sense to most or any of you, it does make sense for us.

    We do not transfer, resell, or give out licenses for vBulletin from our site directly. It is clearly against the rules of the vBulletin license.

    A) The licenses come from the source, vbulletin.com

    B) We buy them for our customers, at full price, directly from vbulletin.com

    C) The customer then obtains support either from GlowHost, since we offer support for vBulletin, or they can get support directly from vBulletin directly since they own the license, the account, and their vBulletin logins.

    That is all there is to it.

    The customer gets a real software license (brand new) and real support from vBulletin. They also receive quality hosting from us. We believe that if we provide quality hosting, they would have no reason to change hosts. Sure there are always cheaters out there, but the majority of the people using our service are not scammers, and end up staying with us.

    It is win-win for everyone involved. The only party that stands to loose anything is GlowHost so it is a great incentive for us to provide a quality service. If we gave out vBulletin licenses and poor service, we would have been out of business a long time ago.

    We belive in our product and that is why we think of this offer as an acceptable risk for GlowHost.
    To clarify, are you registering the vBulletin purchase in the client's name with their email address?
    Vote for:

    - *Admin Settable Paid Subscription Reminder Timeframe*
    -
    *PM - Add ability to reply to originator only*
    - Add Admin ability to auto-subscribe users to specific channel(s)
    - Highlight the correct navigation tab when you are on a custom page
    - "Quick Route" Interface...
    - Allow to use custom icons for individual forums

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Steve Machol View Post
      Anyone can purchase a license and use it for a client's site. That does not mean the client owns the license. The host would retain ownership.

      As for whether it's a scam or not, I really don't know. I only see two licenses under their account and one of them is for their own forums.
      This post is a clear breach of ethics, and I agree with the glowhost poster's disappointment in discussing his account in an open forum......

      That being said, there is definetly a business model that could be created by someone to manage and maintain forums, especially with google's new caffeine algorithm encouraging said functionality.

      I see no ethical problems with allowing a third party provider managing and maintaining their forum. ****, it's hard work trying to do it on my own, and I know software.

      How the mechanics of the purchase happens shouldn't be an issue with vbulletin, and vbulletin should actually be cutting the third party organization a bulk licensing deal.

      Win Win for everyone.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by wcguy View Post
        This post is a clear breach of ethics, and I agree with the glowhost poster's disappointment in discussing his account in an open forum......
        I disagree with your characterization, particularly since that company is purposely advertises they provide vB licenses. Therefore potential customers have legitimate questions as to whether or not this is a valid offer and deserve to know all relevant facts.
        Steve Machol, former vBulletin Customer Support Manager (and NOT retired!)
        Change CKEditor Colors to Match Style (for 4.1.4 and above)

        Steve Machol Photography


        Mankind is the only creature smart enough to know its own history, and dumb enough to ignore it.


        Comment


        • #34
          I agree, Steve, that you can and probably should post that vbulletin will check into it to see what the business model was, and if it was legitimate or not.

          Disclosing how many licenses a person holds was probably not the best way to do it.

          A rewind should have been:

          "We're not familiar with the company. They don't have a resale license. As a matter of fact, no one does. We'll contact the company, and see what's up..."

          then....

          "We've contacted the company. They are in compliance with our terms and conditions. (Or We didn't like the way they were doing it, and asked them to do it a different way in the future).

          Comment


          • #35
            Point taken. However I have already passed off info regarding this company's offer to the people that should check it out. Also it would have been beneficial for them to contact us first so we could have had advance notice of what they were doing and have had a chance to make sure it complied with license transfer rules. I did check for this and could find no relevant notice or request.

            We were taken by surprise by this, and there are some legitimate concerns and questions regarding the rights of our customers.
            Steve Machol, former vBulletin Customer Support Manager (and NOT retired!)
            Change CKEditor Colors to Match Style (for 4.1.4 and above)

            Steve Machol Photography


            Mankind is the only creature smart enough to know its own history, and dumb enough to ignore it.


            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by wcguy View Post
              This post is a clear breach of ethics
              This is not Germany (which has incredibly powerful secrecy laws covering website operations and customer relations).

              Was a confidentiality agreement signed by vBulletin?

              Originally posted by wcguy View Post
              How the mechanics of the purchase happens shouldn't be an issue with vbulletin
              Terms of Use is always an issue.

              Originally posted by wcguy View Post
              and vbulletin should actually be cutting the third party organization a bulk licensing deal.
              I have been championing for a site license and enterprise license for years.

              Comment


              • #37
                I'm amazed all this has gone on for so long unnoticed. It's always been a grey area offering hosting with vBulletin license (one way or another). I remember ages ago the fiasco that mod stirred-up on vB.org that could let a person create forum boards for people to use, or something like that. What a right old palaver that turned into.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Websters
                  Eth"ics (?), n. [Cf. F. éthique. See Ethic.] The science of human duty; the body of rules of duty drawn from this science; a particular system of principles and rules concerting duty, whether true or false; rules of practice in respect to a single class of human actions; as, political or social ethics; medical ethics.
                  http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resourc...ics&use1913=on

                  Sigh, sadly, the study of ethics is no longer required in America. We would be soo much better off.

                  There is a huge difference between ethical behaviors and legal behavior.

                  Legally, I can run up debt in the millions and billions and then default on it when my business model goes upside down.

                  Ethically, it probably wasn't such a good idea to take grandma's money without a hard plan of paying it back.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by MRGTB View Post
                    I'm amazed all this has gone on for so long unnoticed. It's always been a grey area offering hosting with vBulletin license (one way or another). I remember ages ago the fiasco that mod stirred-up on vB.org that could let a person create forum boards for people to use, or something like that. What a right old palaver that turned into.


                    the only "vb service" my host provides is installs only. tbh its a good way to do buisness iirc they do smf and ipb installs aswell.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Steve Machol View Post
                      Point taken. However I have already passed off info regarding this company's offer to the people that should check it out. Also it would have been beneficial for them to contact us first so we could have had advance notice of what they were doing and have had a chance to make sure it complied with license transfer rules. I did check for this and could find no relevant notice or request.

                      We were taken by surprise by this, and there are some legitimate concerns and questions regarding the rights of our customers.
                      We have a ticket in asking for the stipulations about how to be in compliance. At one point in time we wanted to resell the licenses and then that was not possible, so we wanted to lease them, also not possible if we wanted to be in compliance the license guidelines.

                      It was submitted several years ago, it should be one of the first tickets in your history on our account.

                      I can see how that would be easily missed or forgotten, but again that is no reason to release account specific private details like license counts for our account. Its business ethics 101, its privacy best practices, and common sense I would think.

                      In any case, what is done is done and now everyone knows how we do what we do, so there goes our competitive advantage out the window. Not too happy about that but what can I do.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Trevor Hannant View Post
                        To clarify, are you registering the vBulletin purchase in the client's name with their email address?
                        Yes.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by myusername View Post
                          I can see how that would be easily missed or forgotten, but again that is no reason to release account specific private details like license counts for our account. Its business ethics 101, its privacy best practices, and common sense I would think.

                          In any case, what is done is done and now everyone knows how we do what we do, so there goes our competitive advantage out the window. Not too happy about that but what can I do.
                          To be fair to this poster and his company this thread should be deleted/recycled/hidden from public view before it does further damage to his privacy and business operation.

                          My 2c.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Agreed.


                            vB5 is unequivocally the best forum software, but not yet...

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Blubble View Post
                              To be fair to this poster and his company this thread should be deleted/recycled/hidden from public view before it does further damage to his privacy and business operation.

                              My 2c.
                              Well, there are relevant questions and answers in this thread which have been asked elsewhere on this board. Perhaps a pruning of the irrelevant threads would be a better solution since removal is only going to mean similar threads pop up in the future.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by myusername View Post
                                In any case, what is done is done and now everyone knows how we do what we do, so there goes our competitive advantage out the window. Not too happy about that but what can I do.
                                The way I read this thread, you yourself explained how you do what you do: http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showt...97#post1989497 Therefore, you gave away your "competitive advantage" yourself.

                                Not that it matters, but when I set up my first vB forum 3 years ago, my webhost of choice offered to either obtain a license for me, or I could license it myself and send them proof of license and the download from the member's area so they could install it. And as another vB staffer noted earlier in this thread, vB is aware of companies that buy licenses on their clients behalf. So I hardly think what you do is some sort of industry secret.

                                Comment

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