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[Template/hardcoded url bugs] Oh you're gonna love this one--incorrect usage of "&"

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  • Paul
    replied
    Originally posted by freddie
    vB3 will have & instead of & where it is supposed to.


    Now that's an acceptable answer: "Yes it's a problem. We'll make a note to fix it"

    Also can you please cut back on the sarcasm and when making suggestions.
    Excuse my saying so, but had I intended this to be a suggestion I would have posted it in the suggestions forum. The product advertises itself with a DOCTYPE of HTML 4.01 Transitional, yet certain elements are do not comply with that DTD. I do not think that it was intentional on the part of the developers, and therefore I submit this bug report for your review.

    The only significance issue with this problem is the number of templates that will need to be modified to correct this issue and Jelsoft's recommendation that users revert their templates before upgrading this software. For example, the default headers that ship with vBulletin do not specify a character set--doing so without modifying the product setup or administration interface would be impractical for users who use vBulletin in non-Western settings as specifying a western character type would cause their sites to parse incorrectly for their users.

    We have been growing increasingly frustrated with Jelsoft's responses to our problem reports. I'd much rather post a problem once, and leave it at that. I understand that you have a large userbase and limited resources to offer support with.

    As I alluded to in my trouble ticket submitted early this week, it seems to me that Jelsoft's resources are concentrated more on releasing the next major version of their software than providing support for clients that already have chosen vBulletin as their forum of choice and who are depending on it to service the users that visit their respective sites. I don't enjoy getting the run around and then having to explain to our investors why support for the professional product we purchased a license for instead of going with an open source alternative isn't providing working solutions for us. I was responsible for the decision to go with vBulletin and I pushed it as a great product with an excellent support community. I apologize that my frustrations have made their way into my posts here and if I have offended anyone in the process. That certainly wasn't my intention.

    I've chosen to report any problems I find with this product in the appropriate Troubleshooting forum as a service to other users. I am not compensated for providing feedback on this product, nor am I required to do so through any contract or license agreement.

    I suppose it would be easier if we corrected issues that we find ourselves internally and not release information about potential issues with the product to the community. However, we benefit directly from the issues and problems other users post here and hope that other users of this software can benefit from our experiences with it as well.

    If anyone else out there is trying to bring their site up to compliance with HTML 4.01 standards, they now have this additional reference to be aware of and know that they can expect the next major release of this software to ship with valid usage of XHTML 1.0 code.

    I acknowledged in my original post that this is not a critical issue nor should it be treated as such.

    Thank you for your time.

    Leave a comment:


  • tubedogg
    replied
    Originally posted by LoveShack
    Internet Explorer will parse just about anything you throw at it.
    Like I said, it works in all the major browsers. That includes Mozilla. It's not just an "IE will work around it" thing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Freddie Bingham
    replied
    vB3 will have & instead of & where it is supposed to.

    Also can you please cut back on the sarcasm and when making suggestions.

    Leave a comment:


  • fastforward
    replied
    Originally posted by LoveShack
    I would think that someone would have run across this before, but apparently not.
    It has been noticed and discussed before... way back in January ( http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showt...threadid=38084 ).

    There was also a long discussion on HTML standards in general just before that ( http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showt...threadid=36267 ).

    Leave a comment:


  • Paul
    replied
    Originally posted by tubedogg
    It would be pretty silly to run vB3 through a validator now considering that the current style was thrown together for the purposes of putting the public beta up and shares very little if anything with the final style.




    I'm not going to get into an argument about standards with you. The product works as intended in the major browsers. Having it validate would be nice but is meaningless when it works correctly.
    My only reason for posting this issue is so that I don't have to revert and edit ampersands in templates every time a new version is released, especially since it took me so long to figure out what the heck was wrong with every URL that included a querystring. Let's be honest--I don't think this is commonly known. Finding references was hard enough.

    I would think that someone would have run across this before, but apparently not. I'm merely trying to call attention to an issue that may present problems in more rigid browsers. Internet Explorer will parse just about anything you throw at it.

    It's not a critical issue, but if it shows up in vB3 I'll throw a temper-tantrum

    Much love,
    Moi.

    Leave a comment:


  • tubedogg
    replied
    Originally posted by LoveShack

    Running vB3 through the validator today for XHTML 1.0 Transitional produced at least 30 errors.
    It would be pretty silly to run vB3 through a validator now considering that the current style was thrown together for the purposes of putting the public beta up and shares very little if anything with the final style.




    Clearly that is not correct. Where else in vBulletin is 95% valid code acceptible?
    I'm not going to get into an argument about standards with you. The product works as intended in the major browsers. Having it validate would be nice but is meaningless when it works correctly.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paul
    replied
    Originally posted by tubedogg
    vB3 will be, as has been stated many times, XHTML 1.0 Transitional compliant.


    Good Let's at least give that a half-assed attempt before releasing it. Running vB3 through the validator today for XHTML 1.0 Transitional produced at least 30 errors.

    vB2 isn't. We know that, and we have never said it is. However it is about 95% (not counting the & issue).
    On the contrary:

    At the top of every vBulletin generated page, you've put the following

    Code:
    <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
    Clearly that is not correct. Where else in vBulletin is 95% valid code acceptible? Give me a head start.


    I'm not aware of any places in the default templates where <table> appears inside <font> tags.


    If I find any more specific examples as I continue to edit the templates to make it valid HTML 4.01, I'll post it here. I may be confusing <font> with <form> now that I think of it--honestly, after spending two days modifying templates, I don't really recall.
    Last edited by Paul; Fri 22nd Nov '02, 1:53pm. Reason: form, font...something like that.

    Leave a comment:


  • tubedogg
    replied
    vB3 will be, as has been stated many times, XHTML 1.0 Transitional compliant.

    vB2 isn't. We know that, and we have never said it is. However it is about 95% (not counting the &amp; issue). I'm not aware of any places in the default templates where <table> appears inside <font> tags.

    Leave a comment:


  • [Template/hardcoded url bugs] Oh you're gonna love this one--incorrect usage of "&"

    Hello,

    The W3C (those silly guys who standardize HTML) require that when an ampersand is used within an attribute (such as "HREF"), that it be specified as "& amp;" (remove the space) instead of "&". What does this mean? If you want to even come close to having vBulletin, a professional product, validate as HTML 4.01 Transitional or any derivitive thereof, every ampersand in querystring url's needs to be converted to & amp; (remove the space).

    For example:

    Code:
    <a href="register.php?s=$session[sessionhash]&action=signup">
    Is illegal, as "&" is reserved and will result in "&action" being mistaken for an incomplete special character (in this case, &action; ).

    The correct usage is:
    Code:
    <a href="register.php?s=$session[sessionhash]& amp;action=signup">
    (remove the space above--vBulletin will attempt to process it otherwise)

    I would appreciate it if instead of me having to go through every instance of where this happens in templates and in any hardcoded links within the code, that someone make an effort to fix this in a future version of vBulletin (read: vB3).

    This would also need to be handled when vBulletin parses URLs (a simple preg_replace should suffice).

    vBulletin, out of the box, doesn't validate. That's pretty lame for a $160 web-based product.

    References:
    http://www.w3.org/Addressing/
    http://www.htmlhelp.com/faq/html/lin...link-msie-only
    http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2396.txt

    Note that the "?" and other "&" character in this URL are not encoded since they're used for their reserved purposes. However, when this URL is used as an attribute value in an HTML document, the "&" character must be encoded as "&amp;", like the following: <A HREF="http://www.foo.com/foo.cgi?rhyme=Jack%26Jill& amp;audience=child">
    (remove the space)

    I won't even get into <table></table> being stuck within <font> tags. Kindly attempt to run your product through http://validator.w3.org

    Thanks,
    Paul
    Last edited by Paul; Thu 21st Nov '02, 10:35pm.
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