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vb 5 - the base of the modern community

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  • Wayne Luke
    replied
    So thoroughly off-topic that this thread isn't even useful anymore.

    Leave a comment:


  • Alfa1
    replied
    Originally posted by Fortforum View Post
    I got myself a vb 5 license. I installed it, and the whole process took me about 20 mins. It was a hazzle free download, installation and setup.

    I have seen many threads here talking vb5 down, but i must counter that. The concept of vb5 is different from what i´v seen before. It´s different from vb4, xf, ipb, phpbb. But it is to the better. Ok, this product is in beta, we have all heard that, and i just can´t belive people are even trying to upgrade live boards at this stage.

    I like vb 5 already. A bunch of stuff needs to be completed ofcourse, as it´s obviously missing, but there is a huge potential here. Was this lisence to expensive? No, because we are paying for the finalized product, and while waiting for it, we can familiarize ourselvs with the new concept.

    To me, this approach has worked perfectly. I like vb 5 already, and as i skipped the vb 4 gen, im realy looking forward to upgrade all my boards to vb5. So to all pessimists here, i say that we should keep our spirits up, and wait. This will be a great product. And in the meantime, we have time to master sitebuilder. What a great feature! I helped me to get vb look just the way i wanted it to. I did´t lioke the subforums that was default under the Forum tab. I little sitebuilder magic did the trick.

    There are a few boards out there, but face it: vb is the king of forums!
    I like the concept of vb5 as well. Though I do not find it much different from XenForo. I see a lot of functions and design decisions which seem to be inspired by XenForo.
    Much of your expectations are based upon the faith that IB will put in the effort to bring vb5 to true Gold standard, will deliver 125 announced features and (not unimportant) is also capable of doing so.
    This is something that I am very uncertain of. They may well bring vb5 to Gold standard. But can we really have faith in this?
    IB's track record shows that:
    - A long list of announced vb4 features never arrived.
    - Years of development inactivity after initial wave of mega sales.
    - 3 years after release vb4 still has 850 bugs including fatal errors, data loss and critical bugs. It seems highly unlikely that vb4 will ever get fixed.
    - They still advertise and sell a malfunctioning mobile suite. After years, people still can barely use the product they bought. If at all.

    That at least shows there is sound reason to be careful with expectations and faith in IB.

    There also is the question if vb5 is fixable at all. You can't build a building on a poorly designed foundation without running into severe problems later on.
    In my experience with poorly designed software, it can be a major headache and fixing one bug can easily result in new bugs. It continuously needs support. Especially if you run an active site with lots of users encountering every possible situation.

    So, the question very much is: Is vbulletin 5 a solid base of the modern community?

    Leave a comment:


  • Janmaat
    replied
    + 1

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  • slinky
    replied
    Originally posted by soniceffect View Post
    Slinky, honest question. Why are you here? I have seen people say "oh we should be able to say xyz" and thats quite correct, however what on earth is the idea behind coming onto a topic where someone is happy with the product and trying to destroy the reputation of it with them also. Suppose I should state the below save you trying to "convert" me,
    30 day ticket support... Slowness... Messy CSS ... Im condifent it will be
    Do whatever you want, I don't care. I never mentioned VB5's extreme slowness, messy CSS or 30 day ticket support in this thread or any other thread -- yet you feel you must crusade to tell everyone how confident you are about this laundry list of VB 5 problems being fixed. Why? Please don't involve me or attribute me with anything in your positive ramblings and absurd claims about all your threads being trashed.

    Originally posted by soniceffect View Post
    Licence transfer - Im actually in the EU so could do so, however would have to pay for it. well it involves admin at the end of the day so fair enough.
    Domain change - Im pretty sure that by giving you the ability to change it in your panel that is vbuletin giving you permission, however doesnt bother me either way.
    VB Facebook Privacy concerns - Im assuming you have never read facebooks terms, so you carry on asking questions and enjoy yourself.
    So being in the US is not important. Licensing is a trivial matter where you hope for this and hope for that. FYI - if it's not there you don't have the rights. For example, vB 3 license holders cannot access the latest versions because IB/VB can legally withhold them for payment of a VB 5 upgrade. Your confidence means nothing. Regarding Facebook privacy, only a fool isn't aware of Facebook privacy issues. And if you read the thread, it's 100% clear I read them and any webmaster should at least try not to make privacy policies the joking matter you are.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Originally posted by Fortforum View Post
    This is a problem, but as stated, it´s not about the software. I want to do the right thing, but this is not what i expected, to be honest. A simple changeover in the customer details should do it, and im confident that is what it will be in the end. About facebook, my users tend not to like the bridge to fb, very few have used it, and it seems that people are kind of reluctant to use it. They just don´t want there forum life to be associated with there fb life, and i can appreciate that.
    It's not a wise move to buy anything based upon faith in the good of mankind. Nobody believed they would have to buy VB 5 just to go from VB 3.8.5 to Vb 3.8.6 or VB 3.8.7. Regarding Facebook - go beyond just technical issues. What if your forum users (and you) find out that Internet Brands has been using your forum users' data in some fashion for their own purposes? In looking back, I think this was asked over a year ago and the company avoided answer. This information is probably what you want to tell your users before they consent to using the Facebook App, isn't it?

    Originally posted by Fortforum View Post
    Futhermore, i still havn´t figured out why you feel the need of using such strong language when expressing your feelings on vb5. You talk about an "embarrassing fiasco" and a "technical disaster". I think it´s way to early to judge, and personaly i wouldn´t do that until all the facts are in.
    This has nothing to do with VB5. It concerns other purchases. I suspect they created a monster problem internally and are think they can force customers to deal with all of their problems. Take the VB 4 license transfers issue as one example. Coincidentally around the time VB 5 is launched, customers can no longer transfer VB 4 licenses. Then there is a statement that you can - they just they can't technically do it for the indefinite future and they have no date when this will be fixed. How could this happen? I don't have much time for further discussion here. I'm hoping that others will calm down and get back to reasonable discussion. I'm unsubscribing.
    Last edited by slinky; Thu 27 Sep '12, 7:27am.

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  • soniceffect
    replied
    Originally posted by rexxxy View Post
    Y'all leave slinky alone. He invest more money in vbulletin than some of the people complaining about him expressing his views.

    So because you're in the EU and it doesn't apply to you it's oh well who cares? So Because your members don't like FB and his does means he's not suppose to care about privacy concerns?
    Yout missing the poiny. There is bo issue with expressing his view. The issue is with trashing every positive thread as if they are in the wrong for liking something.

    Leave a comment:


  • rexxxy
    replied
    vb 5 - the base of the modern community

    Y'all leave slinky alone. He invest more money in vbulletin than some of the people complaining about him expressing his views.

    So because you're in the EU and it doesn't apply to you it's oh well who cares? So Because your members don't like FB and his does means he's not suppose to care about privacy concerns?

    Leave a comment:


  • Fortforum
    replied
    Originally posted by slinky View Post
    VB 5 License: Did you realize that VB 5 doesn't allow you to transfer your license? Worse, read the terms that made their way into the fine print and you'll discover that you cannot change the domain of your VB 5 license unless you (i) obtain written approval from vBSI/IB, and (ii) pay them some as yet undisclosed fee. Most companies will reasonably disclose this to customers up front about major licensing changes like this.
    This is a problem, but as stated, it´s not about the software. I want to do the right thing, but this is not what i expected, to be honest. A simple changeover in the customer details should do it, and im confident that is what it will be in the end.

    About facebook, my users tend not to like the bridge to fb, very few have used it, and it seems that people are kind of reluctant to use it. They just don´t want there forum life to be associated with there fb life, and i can appreciate that.

    Futhermore, i still havn´t figured out why you feel the need of using such strong language when expressing your feelings on vb5. You talk about an "embarrassing fiasco" and a "technical disaster". I think it´s way to early to judge, and personaly i wouldn´t do that until all the facts are in.

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  • soniceffect
    replied
    Slinky, honest question. Why are you here? I have seen people say "oh we should be able to say xyz" and thats quite correct, however what on earth is the idea behind coming onto a topic where someone is happy with the product and trying to destroy the reputation of it with them also.


    Suppose I should state the below save you trying to "convert" me,

    30 day ticket support - I can honestly say I have used vbulletin since early 3 and I have used ticket support maybe 2-3 times since then. Therefore doesnt bother me.

    Licence transfer - Im actually in the EU so could do so, however would have to pay for it. well it involves admin at the end of the day so fair enough.

    Domain change - Im pretty sure that by giving you the ability to change it in your panel that is vbuletin giving you permission, however doesnt bother me either way

    Slowness - This is being addressed and Im confident it will be sorted

    Messy CSS - Im aware of this and its in Jira being address. Im condifent it will be

    VB Facebook Privacy concerns - Im assuming you have never read facebooks terms, so you carry on asking questions and enjoy yourself.

    Leave a comment:


  • slinky
    replied
    Originally posted by djbaxter View Post
    I thought the word of the day was "fanboys"? Either way, your assertion that we're are looking to sell our forums to IB or anyone else, or that we're hoping to become staff (really? and have to put up with the sort of nonsense you spout? I don't think so) is beyond ludicrous.
    I didn't say I was talking about you specifically. Unless you know everyone well, you should quit using the word "we." The only thing "ludicrous" is someone who scolds others as if he is authority and isn't even aware of the basics.

    Originally posted by djbaxter View Post
    You could still use your old vB3 license you know.
    More complete rubbish from you. You don't know. The only solution to the problem made available by IB is to buy VB5 to get later releases of VB3. It's disgraceful for IB to have forced customers to buy a full product upgrade to a long dead product instead of reasonably accommodating them. It would have been no sweat to have made the ancient VB 3 upgrades available at a reasonable cost. Hence you see a lot of well earned venom from many customers.

    You should never have seized upon two harmless sentences in the attempt to be a wiseguy. You've needlessly caused a firestorm and continue to derail this thread with meaningless comments full of misinformation that indicate you're the last person people here should go to for facts. I propose you end the crusade and just drop it.
    Last edited by slinky; Wed 26 Sep '12, 9:35pm.

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  • djbaxter
    replied
    Originally posted by slinky View Post
    I'm in the process of moving all my sites off of vBulletin.
    But you still had to return to announce your departure?

    Originally posted by slinky View Post
    remember, they have their own agendas. Some of these sycophants are foolishly hoping IB might buy out their middling forums for a financial windfall and others are hoping to call themselves staff soon.
    I thought the word of the day was "fanboys"? Either way, your assertion that we're are looking to sell our forums to IB or anyone else, or that we're hoping to become staff (really? and have to put up with the sort of nonsense you spout? I don't think so) is beyond ludicrous.

    Originally posted by slinky View Post
    I was hoping that my VB 3 investment had somewhere to go
    You could still use your old vB3 license you know.

    Originally posted by slinky View Post
    I don't expect to continue the conversation here nor in the forum much longer.
    Thank you. That will be sincerely appreciated.

    Leave a comment:


  • slinky
    replied
    Originally posted by Paul M View Post
    No, Im talking about YOU, and your endless quest to rant on about IB and the past in every thread you can find.
    I guess your own forum must be doing spectacularly well since you obviously have so much free time to spend here ranting on about the same old thing again, and again.
    Im sure that even if you wildest predictions and desires came true, and everyone left, you would still be here going on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on ....
    After a day of silence you had to come back to throw kerosene on the fire. Two harmless sentences sent you and the dwindling group of usual cheerleaders into the free game of "flog the customer" because you decide who does and doesn't get banned.

    FYI, periodically I must return here to the forum to discover critical information that should have been honestly disclosed to customers. Thanks to the latest and stupidest fraud and/or incompetence that I have seen in a long time, I'm in the process of moving all my sites off of vBulletin. Even VB staff are confused by this embarrassing fiasco. VB5's technical disaster aside (that I didn't even discuss or "rant" about), this latest act that significant affects my forums was the clincher. I'll have plenty of time soon to be productive and not waste it on issues like this.

    Originally posted by Fortforum View Post
    I had very high hopes for vb4, but i was disapointed, so i know what you are talking about. I know all about waiting for updates and such, but i skipped vb 4 early in the process for reasons stated earlier in this thread. First, it´s hard to point out the feeling of a software, but with this i get a good one.
    Thanks for the comment - and yes, that's all I addressed. Good to know that you've kept an eye on things during that time. My apologies in what happened in this thread - I never expected two harmless sentences to set the usual crusading cheerleaders into endless rants about things that never took place here and I tried to put an end to it swiftly. But remember, they have their own agendas. Some of these sycophants are foolishly hoping IB might buy out their middling forums for a financial windfall and others are hoping to call themselves staff soon.

    Like yourself, I was hoping that my VB 3 investment had somewhere to go. I looked at VB 5, which I haven't even criticized, and had serious concerns beyond the endless torrent of negative comments about VB5 from others. While I too like to trust my "feelings" I've taken a look at some facts and items you should think about before introducing your clients to VB 5.

    VB 5 License: Did you realize that VB 5 doesn't allow you to transfer your license? Worse, read the terms that made their way into the fine print and you'll discover that you cannot change the domain of your VB 5 license unless you (i) obtain written approval from vBSI/IB, and (ii) pay them some as yet undisclosed fee. Most companies will reasonably disclose this to customers up front about major licensing changes like this. The perpetrator of the ranting here, djbaxter, was hysterical and uniformed in finding out this fact about the VB 5 license.

    VB 4-5 / Facebook App Privacy Concerns: Buying VB 5 means getting the Facebook App. A simple, reasonable question was asked of IB - what does and has IB been doing with the data collected via the Facebook apps? I and others found the thread disturbing, a failure to provide any reasonable answer after 2 weeks and counting. There is no privacy policy that I can see that applies either with regard to all the sensitive information that is passed to IB from your customer forums in providing you this "service." Take a look at the vBulletin.com Facebook App page -- as of two weeks ago I still didn't recall seeing any privacy policy at all. <Paul quickly types off a message to the legal department?> So what was done with the huge amount of FB info you just sent to vBulletin.com about yourself, your friends, etc.? This kind of incompetence leaves me with no confidence in the product or whatever excuse may make it here claiming that nobody can prove that anything nefarious actually happened.

    Anyways, best of luck to you. I didn't care to expound this greatly but some here keep alluding to rants about the past. I came back here to look at the future. After a major 11 year investment in vBulletin, I have substantive reasons for leaving, not merely emotional. Thanks for the comment, I don't expect to continue the conversation here nor in the forum much longer.

    Leave a comment:


  • djbaxter
    replied
    The point is that search engines do not have trouble indexing these pages. There may be a problem with how they are indexed, yes, but this is still a beta version after all and that demo may still be the alpha version for all I know.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sushubh
    replied
    40 search results for three pages? titles are common for individual posts and comments (throughout the forum!):

    post - vBulletin
    Comment - vBulletin
    and these post ends up linking to the thread page. i do not see how it can be considered as good indexing considering google is treating individual posts in a thread as an independent web page. also, me as a user cannot even link to individual posts in a thread right now. individual posts needs to be relative links not absolute links like google is treating them here.

    again. i am not an expert in seo. but these search results are a collasal mess for someone searching through the forum. titles needs to be descriptive. a thread should only have individual pages indexed. i have no clue if vB5 is handling canonical links properly or not. and if they are planning to add support for micro-formats now that they are accepted by all the popular search engines.

    Leave a comment:


  • djbaxter
    replied
    Clearly it's not HURTING indexing by your own example.

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  • Sushubh
    replied
    google indexing of a thread with three pages...

    http://goo.gl/l9DGX

    right now, vbulletin is not linking permalinks of individual posts. google is somehow finding tons of internal links and indexing them. it should technically restrict the search results to just three individual pages of the thread. if this is how it would be for the stable edition, there is going to be lot of issues related to duplicate content, duplicate title and so on.

    again, i understand that this is just beta and the developers would probably fix a lot of things that should resolve this problem. but right now? ajax is not helping much when it comes to search engine indexing.

    Leave a comment:

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