3 month extension feedback

[pablo]

Seeing as this thread was closed .... https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...sion?p=2275126 which was the feedback for
https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...Early-Adopters

vBulletin recently granted 3-month license extensions to all Mobile Suite early adopters who purchased their suite within the first 90 days that it was offered. We granted the extensions to show appreciation for those who supported the product in its infancy.

Under the leadership of our mobile project manager Omid Majdi, who has recently taken the reigns of this product, the vBulletin Mobile Suite has entered a new era of fast, robust development. With several planned releases that include bug fixes, feature enhancements and new feature development, we look forward to the growth and progress of our vBulletin mobile applications.

We are committed to the future development of this product and appreciate the positive and construtive feedback that you have given us thus far. We have created a feedback discussion this topic HERE.

Helping you build better communities,

Your vBulletin Development Team

While I welcome the 3 month extension, I feel like there wasn't much development for much longer, i.e. August 2011 through to February 2012. Which would be really closer to 6 months, IMHO. Also seeing as vBulletin failed to deliver, I feel that there should be an additional extension, of maybe 6 months. So that would mean that they would grant people 12 months extension.

Also I feel that the fact that this is limited to only the people who bought in the first 90 days, is also a bit of a disappointment. If this was the only outcome of the feedback survey, then I really fear for the continued interest in the vBulletin mobile app.

I've added a poll to get people's views ....

[oldlock]

Well, after two months of our wounderful free extension nothing much has changed. I, for one am not going to renew this product unless there is massive and rapid improvement in it in very short order ....

[Trevor Hannant]

1.3 should be released later this week, 1.4 is already being worked on and a number of items already fixed for that build:

https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...e-Mobile-Suite

[Mark.B]

I tried out the mobile style that ships with 4.1.12 the other day, not tested it since last year and..whoops, it's actually not that bad now.

[oldlock]

1.3 should be released later this week, 1.4 is already being worked on and a number of items already fixed for that build:

https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...e-Mobile-Suite

OK. Correct me if I am wrong but it's all fixes for things that have been broken for months ? So what will I be getting new for my money if I renew - given that the product has not been fit for purpose for many months, with nil development for most of the past 12 months .............

[Trevor Hannant]

There are not only Bug fixes going on but some improvements are being made also. I also know that Omid, the PM in charge of Mobile has plans on improvements for upcoming versions also.

Is there anything specifically you want to see added? If so, have you got a link to the JIRA entry for it?

[SteveLV702]

Is there anything specifically you want to see added? If so, have you got a link to the JIRA entry for it?

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[slinky]

Well, after two months of our wounderful free extension nothing much has changed. I, for one am not going to renew this product unless there is massive and rapid improvement in it in very short order ....

1.3 should be released later this week, 1.4 is already being worked on and a number of items already fixed for that build:
https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...e-Mobile-Suite

There are not only Bug fixes going on but some improvements are being made also. I also know that Omid, the PM in charge of Mobile has plans on improvements for upcoming versions also. Is there anything specifically you want to see added? If so, have you got a link to the JIRA entry for it?

Trevor - I truly appreciate your reply and desire to assist the customer, as always. But here we are.... again... within 4 weeks of VBSI seeking more money with promises of future improvements and "several planned releases that include bug fixes, feature enhancements and new feature development" that still aren't here.

For well over a half year there weren't any updates to the mobile apps. Suddenly as we approach the expiration date, the extreme marketing team first polls current purchasers to determine how many are still paying attention -- can vBulletin get away with offering only 3 months work in exchange for not performing any updates for well over 6 months? Anyone with a sense of decency would at least try to make up for what you didn't provide. The extensions should have been 4-6 months from the date of a major mobile suite release. Instead VBSI put out an extreme marketing release without an apology to customers for gross neglect of the mobile app and failure to deliver for many months. VBSI did this "to show appreciation for those who supported the product in its infancy." It's pretty insulting to say the least. This 3 month extension was an excuse to buy time to hire a team to develop the product customers paid to receive, didn't receive, and sell it to them again as a renewal.

Making things more complicated, VBSI recently purchased ForumRunner and now this seems to take #1 priority over the Mobile Suite. For the past 2 months we've seen a rush to integrate the product into the VBSI core, etc. which didn't need to be done since ForumRunner works without integration. And what about the VBSI promise that the Mobile Suite would be the top mobile solution the company would offer? I still haven't installed the several licenses I paid for given how poorly it has been managed and the failure to provide a road map of what the mobile product is now supposed to be. Customers should have been offered ForumRunner or a full refund. Now it's just a big mess, which is par for the course here since 2009.

[Trevor Hannant]

How do I put this without coming over in a patronising and argumentative manner....

I appreciate where you're coming from but constantly sniping at Support staff who have no say in these things is not going to get you or other customers anywhere - it just rubs our backs up and earns you a reputation on here amongst staff and other customers. FWIW, Support argued for a significant time (along with other staff who I won't name) for the extension to be 6 months but 3 months is what was approved. We expressed our disappointment but that's all we can do - we can't strike, throw a hissy fit or otherwise change the rules. If you disagree with this, raise a ticket and we'll pass it to the appropriate person - sounding off at me or my colleagues won't get this changed.

Mobile development has speeded up significantly and releases would have been out faster had they not also relied on updates to the core and MAPI code which has delayed things slightly. Omid is working hard to ramp things up further and improve the product and (frequent) discussions I've had with him have left me very positive after being a vocal critic behind the scenes. I'm confident that the work Omid is doing will show to be fruitful.

My understanding (I'm sure Omid will correct me if wrong) is that 1.3 is due to be released to customers as soon as Apple approves the vb.com app - it's ready to go, it just needs that final step. That gives us around a 6 week turnaround for updates which I'm confident will continue to be the frequency Omid is aiming for - quicker if he can get it.

In addition to the App updates, there are some changes being worked on for the Publisher itself and for the signing process to make it easier however these rely on other factors such as non-mobile developer availability which can also slow the process down slightly. That said, and as I said previously, I'm confident in the approach Omid is taking with Mobile and I look forward to what he will bring to the Suite.

[slinky]

How do I put this without coming over in a patronising and argumentative manner....I appreciate where you're coming from but constantly sniping at Support staff who have no say in these things is not going to get you or other customers anywhere - it just rubs our backs up and earns you a reputation on here amongst staff and other customers. FWIW, Support argued for a significant time (along with other staff who I won't name) for the extension to be 6 months but 3 months is what was approved. We expressed our disappointment but that's all we can do - we can't strike, throw a hissy fit or otherwise change the rules. If you disagree with this, raise a ticket and we'll pass it to the appropriate person - sounding off at me or my colleagues won't get this changed.

Trevor - I thanked you and support staff for excellent work to make sure you understood that my grievance is targeted at management -- whom we have been long told reads these threads. Yet again, many customers appreciate your efforts and staff to "do the right thing." But where does that get the customers regarding the product if the company's decision is to NOT do the right thing, repeatedly? When it comes renewal time, management's game of "good cop - bad cop" does not work. The only thing that matters is that bad cop is demanding hundreds of dollars from me again after I spent money on licenses a year ago and have nothing to show for it!

My complaint on the 3 month extension is 100% legitimate feedback which the company said it wanted. Other customers raised the point about not wanting any more meaningless extensions and want vBulletin to extend our current agreement from the point it delivers a substantial product improvement and update." vBulletin / VBSI can offer a lifetime of support but it means nothing if management equates that to mean one update every ten years. And what happens if customers don't like it? Let them throw a hissy fit. And PS, I already sent in my requests with regard to my complaint months ago but was offered vapor.

I have a fair idea of which staff member you're talking about. Staff should also appreciate that most of us are good, reasonable people and long time customers. We can't always tell who is a reasonable person being forced to say things to customers at the risk of losing their job. But as everyone can see, I didn't brand any of your colleagues at all. I just quoted the words that the company decided to authorize without making it personal as to who is the messenger.

Mobile development has speeded up significantly and releases would have been out faster had they not also relied on updates to the core and MAPI code which has delayed things slightly. Omid is working hard to ramp things up further and improve the product and (frequent) discussions I've had with him have left me very positive after being a vocal critic behind the scenes. I'm confident that the work Omid is doing will show to be fruitful. My understanding (I'm sure Omid will correct me if wrong) is that 1.3 is due to be released to customers as soon as Apple approves the vb.com app - it's ready to go, it just needs that final step. That gives us around a 6 week turnaround for updates which I'm confident will continue to be the frequency Omid is aiming for - quicker if he can get it.

Trevor, I appreciate your positive, optimistic attitude - I do! But I'm the one with a bill awaiting in a month, again, with nothing to show for it. I'm sure you're surrounded by forward thinking project management discussions. Why is vBSI making excuses for delays but not giving the customers an equivalent extension? For example - I prepay vBulletin to build a mobile app in May but, due to some excuse, vBulletin can't start until June. What is happening here is vBulletin is asking me to prepay for the same project in June because the time I bought in May had expired. It's almost insane that customers have to explain why this isn't right!

In addition to the App updates, there are some changes being worked on for the Publisher itself and for the signing process to make it easier however these rely on other factors such as non-mobile developer availability which can also slow the process down slightly. That said, and as I said previously, I'm confident in the approach Omid is taking with Mobile and I look forward to what he will bring to the Suite.

The only thing I'm confident about is that my ability to use all of these things will come after this 3 month "thank you" to customers who will see nothing of value. Throwing another small bone isn't going to make up for all this arguing. This isn't directed at you or any other staff member. Management has long avoided transparency and straight talk here with customers. I'm inviting them here for a meaningful dialog on how to move things forward fairly by addressing the past and ongoing problems that need to be remedied.

[edytwinky]

It's just a weird coincidence that as our three month extension is coming to a close, all the sudden these updates are coming out. Coincidence to get more money?

[Trevor Hannant]

No, that was the point of the extension, to allow you to get updates that should have been out earlier and otherwise you'd have had to renew to get. Whether it should have been 3 or 6 months that was added is a question for senior mnagement (who don't post on here) as they made that call, not those who provide support...

[slinky]

No, that was the point of the extension, to allow you to get updates that should have been out earlier and otherwise you'd have had to renew to get. Whether it should have been 3 or 6 months that was added is a question for senior mnagement (who don't post on here) as they made that call, not those who provide support...

Unfortunately all of this was predictable and senior management clearly must have known that the support period would run out quickly. They knew that you'd need at least a few weeks just to start developing and integrating new team members. The best customers would see is a 3-6 week tease of the mobile suite product they paid for and waited a long, long time to receive followed by a renewal fee you need to pay for any practical usage. This poor customer treatment has been a repeated pattern since 2009.

What makes this even more difficult to accept is that we were sold a mobile product that was guaranteed to be the best of what IB /vBulletin had to offer. If the mobile suite is less than what Forum Runner offers, then the company is breaching it's representations of the mobile product with "early adopters" of the mobile suite. And with IB competing with every single one of our forums, IB's own vBulletin sites get to choose the superior mobile product for free.

So here's a good question - why don't senior management post here at all any more? When IB/vBulletin wanted to sell vBulletin 4, both Bob the CEO and Joe the CTO had blog posts and really hyped up the product. And after the disastrous release, suddenly they distanced themselves from any interaction with the customer and let the staff take the heat for every poor and brutally profit-driven decision that was made at the expense of the customer. I hope you (and your colleagues ) can remember that many customers appreciate what is going on. But if some staff members try to justify the above as some have instead of distancing themselves from the decision/policy makers, it's difficult not to expect to hear about it from the customers. I don't think anyone would expect you to lobby for us and put your job on the line.

The bottom line is that I still haven't installed the mobile suite because there won't be time to await bugs to be worked out before being held up again for more money. It looks like I won't have to plan to install the suite because time has run out and now I have an answer and can get back to other work. There isn't more to be said on this topic as it is what it is. Trevor, thank you for listening, responding and doing what you could on behalf of the customers.

[Alfa1]

There are not only Bug fixes going on but some improvements are being made also. I also know that Omid, the PM in charge of Mobile has plans on improvements for upcoming versions also.

Is there anything specifically you want to see added? If so, have you got a link to the JIRA entry for it?

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[acwatts]

Yes we got an extension alright, but the mobile app seemed to go backwards. I also think the apple and android apps should be completely separate, I don't use the apple app but I am being held up waiting for the android update and wasting my money because we have to wait for a bad apple.

I'm not paying again until there has been major improvement in the apps, I will just keep someone else's vb app on my phone a just keep checking how far things have moved along. Why waste good money on slow progress when some other mug can do it for me.