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4.0 upgrade - DON'T DO IT if you have any Mods - and probably, don't do it period!

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  • #91
    Well, I think we should all be sure to subscribe to this topic and see if anyone is listening.

    Personally, I have been able to migrate my site perfectly, which I'm very impressed and very hopeful this new CMS grows strong. I am however, very reluctant to go live with vb4 because I don't have much faith in the future of this new company. I think they are seriously overwhelmed and in total turmoil. Reading endless posts with no answers like described above, isn't a good sign.

    The software is getting better, yes.... I guess we are all impatient, excited and getting slightly paranoid.
    What do others really think?
    Cheers!

    RECORDING ORG
    created for musicians, by musicians

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Conner View Post
      So now, any time I make a post, I have to start it with "Yes, before anyone says another thing about firebug, the search feature and the pdf manuals.. I've used them". Some things you just can't find on your own. Which is why there are tech support and moderators.
      How do you think tech support and mods find the stylevar? firebug. I am pretty sure they don't have some manual that they are not sharing where they get all the answers.

      Sorry, but if I can find it by firebug, so can others. If I see a thread where someone is asking for help with a stylevar and no one has helped them, I post a link to the blogs/articles that are useful. I suppose in the future I can just ignore the threads, but *most* users have found those blogs and articles helpful because *most* users would like to be able to do things on their own instead of asking for help.

      Please don't PM or VM me for support - I only help out in the threads.
      vBulletin Manual & vBulletin 4.0 Code Documentation (API)
      Want help modifying your vbulletin forum? Head on over to vbulletin.org
      If I post CSS and you don't know where it goes, throw it into the additional.css template.

      W3Schools <- awesome site for html/css help

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      • #93
        I have no problems with the installation, but there's just so little documentation. Although our 3.x forum was running well, I upgraded to 4.0 because I needed to get on with some styling and integration issues and I knew that pursuing those in 3.x was going to be a dead end. I haven't done much templating in 4.x yet but what little I've done has worked fine. Still, there were numerous blank help windows encountered during the process. The installation/upgrade instructions were a total hodgepodge of cut&paste from older versions with stuff that didn't apply or was just wrong.

        No one has time to write a manual and there are unanswered threads everywhere. I really think the release was rushed and yes, I suspect the employees are totally overwhelmed. I'm glad I upgraded for the reasons I listed, but for nearly $200 I'd think the release should have been more polished. Some of the open-source programs I use have better forum support from the developers.
        My VB forum: BMWRA

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        • #94
          Thumbs up for vBulletin 4

          Originally posted by Lynne View Post
          How do you think tech support and mods find the stylevar? firebug. I am pretty sure they don't have some manual that they are not sharing where they get all the answers.

          Sorry, but if I can find it by firebug, so can others. If I see a thread where someone is asking for help with a stylevar and no one has helped them, I post a link to the blogs/articles that are useful. I suppose in the future I can just ignore the threads, but *most* users have found those blogs and articles helpful because *most* users would like to be able to do things on their own instead of asking for help.
          Lynne you couldn't be more right. I believe if I can find it on my own, I'll do a better job of taking care of my site, rather then depending on others. Although I've seen you help quite a lot of folks. I don't mind asking for help, if I really need it, there are lot's of folks here willing to help.

          I'm sure we all get frustrated occasionally, but to comment on the overall concern of "this new company," well I don't think so.

          I'm not reluctant to go live with vb4 and I will as soon as our team finishes with the redesign (flow) of our site, how we handle different information. vB4 gives us wonderful opportunity to be more effective communicators.

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Lynne View Post
            I suppose in the future I can just ignore the threads, but *most* users have found those blogs and articles helpful because *most* users would like to be able to do things on their own instead of asking for help.
            If all I'm being helped with is a link and a reference to firebug, ignore my posts. And of course, *most* users want to be able to do things on their own without asking for help. But in this case, *most* of us can't. Do you think I like coming here and asking questions that I have to wait for days to get answers for? Nine times out of ten, I'll ask for support, not get it, and 3 days later I figure it out on my own. But in those however many days, I'm at the computer for hours doing it. In the future, I'll save the 5 minutes it takes me to type out my problem and put it toward figuring it out on my own. At least it will more than likely get figured out 5 minutes quicker than usual.

            By the way, when the license is paid for, from my understanding, it also comes with updates and support. And when the $60-$80 is paid to renew the support and updates for another year, I'd expect no posts to go unanswered, no matter what the problem is. But you know, I'm just another one of those people who want everything done for me and I ask for help. I'm guessing none of you have ever asked for help.. ever?

            By the way *part 2*.. why are the support forums here? vBulletin should just make a forum that redirects to the articles that help *most* users instead of going through the trouble of just copying and pasting a link.. just my thought, if it's wrong to ask for support and not want the same link for each of your problems, every single time you have a problem.
            Last edited by Conner; Fri 1 Jan '10, 2:57pm.

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            • #96
              The forums are more community based support, and while we do provide support for our products via the support forums, the ticket system always has top priority.

              On the subject of modifications, we only help with basic modifications when we have time. We're doing our best right now to deal with tickets and the forums.

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              • #97
                Originally posted by Conner View Post
                If all I'm being helped with is a link and a reference to firebug, ignore my posts. And of course, *most* users want to be able to do things on their own without asking for help. But in this case, *most* of us can't. Do you think I like coming here and asking questions that I have to wait for days to get answers for? Nine times out of ten, I'll ask for support, not get it, and 3 days later I figure it out on my own. But in those however many days, I'm at the computer for hours doing it. In the future, I'll save the 5 minutes it takes me to type out my problem and put it toward figuring it out on my own. At least it will more than likely get figured out 5 minutes quicker than usual.
                Sorry I got a bit snippy with you, Conner, I didn't mean to. I post a couple of links to some articles and blogs because it does help a lot of people who come on here and type nothing more that "I need to know where these stylevars are - someone tell me." If a users posts more than that, something like "I tried to find it with firebug and found the class .postbit .whatever and looked it up and found it was stylevar yyyy, however, when I changed that, nothing happened and I can't figure out why" or if they say "I tried the stylevar dictionary and I tried firebug and just can't figure it out" then I usually try to see what is going on. But, normally it is just a user who doesn't know about the blogs and doesn't know about firebug and so I post those links to help them out. Anyway, sorry for snipping at you.

                Please don't PM or VM me for support - I only help out in the threads.
                vBulletin Manual & vBulletin 4.0 Code Documentation (API)
                Want help modifying your vbulletin forum? Head on over to vbulletin.org
                If I post CSS and you don't know where it goes, throw it into the additional.css template.

                W3Schools <- awesome site for html/css help

                Comment


                • #98
                  I have some apologizing to do as well. I think we're all just frustrated at this point. Most of us users are frustrated because it seems like a long road to getting used to things. And I'm sure the staff is frustrated due to us users not understanding. I've decided to wait until the next release to see if there's anything different. I'm really sorry for getting snippy with you as well.

                  I wasn't necessarily pointing you out when I was talking about the links to the manuals and firebug. That's just all I see from anyone trying to help. It's well appreciated.. just frustrating when I've already done it and can't find the answer. It's not so much of the frustration of getting those responses. It's more along the lines of that's all the help there is available. Most of the problems I have, I have found in firebug and fixed, or at least figured out the general area that needs attention, but can't figure out where to go with it. For example, I made a post about the CMS columns. I know what needs attention, but I don't know the settings I need to use in the Default Template HTML to make the columns 25%, 100%, 25%. I like to use percentages rather than fixed widths due to different screen resolutions, but I need to make the side columns wide enough for content like youtube videos that are 250px in width. But like I want to do with the columns, I just use a percentage width="100%" on the videos and try not to set the height too high in case someone with a 800x600 screen resolution comes to my site.

                  Anyway, before I ramble anymore, I'm very sorry for the way I spoke to you.

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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by MDawg View Post
                    This is another major point - if we paid for BLOG, then we should get 4.0 Suite free now!
                    I agree. I didn't realize my blog wouldn't work my fault for not reading the fine print. But still....
                    Jenny Wanderscheid
                    http://childfun.com

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                    • Originally posted by MDawg View Post
                      The point of this thread is to forget about 4.0 unless you want a plain Jane forum that is inferior to a rocking 3.8.4 + Mods forum.

                      At the moment, I can't even have a plain Jane forum, as 4.0 doesn't work at all.
                      No the point of this thread is to have a whinge when really you are the one at fault for:-
                      A) Not taking backups as advised
                      B) Not removing mods as advised.

                      The vBulletin Support team are not responsible if you decide not to take the steps that are advised.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by sportsfi View Post
                        No the point of this thread is to have a whinge when really you are the one at fault for:-
                        A) Not taking backups as advised
                        B) Not removing mods as advised.

                        The vBulletin Support team are not responsible if you decide not to take the steps that are advised.
                        Sorry, but I disagree.

                        vB should check during upgrade and install that all mods are disabled. In fact, it should actually disable them and/or give a strong warning. And yes, most experienced admins would take a backup first, however what is becoming apparent is that this is the first release where it is VITAL you take a backup because of the higher probability of a bork job.

                        Always easier to wash your hands of responsibility though instead of having to code a user friendly system
                        My Twitterings

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                        • Simply adding two questions with with radio buttons at the start of the upgrade would be an improvement.

                          Have you disabled MODs (Y/N) ?
                          Have you backed up your DB (Y/N) ?

                          Answer no to either and it quits.

                          That would have stopped many many upgrade failures

                          Comment


                          • This thread is epic fail.

                            The original poster should have made backups before installing 4.0 and been prepared to roll back to 3.8 in case 4.0 didn't work out.

                            4.0 is new software, and the StyleVars, CSS, and Javascript are a tangled mess. Expecting to be able to migrate from 3.8 to 4.0 "on the fly" on a running forum is idiotic. Nobody should do a 3.8 -> 4.0 upgrade unless you have NO modifications and NO style changes except colors. Everyone else should install 4.0 in a separate forum and spend days/weeks tinkering to get it looking how you want.


                            On the other hand, bravo to people for their superiority and skills in programming, debugging, firebug, etc. etc. and have been alpha testing 4.0 for 2 months now. Crushing other customers really makes us appreciate your posts. It makes me want to login every day to read your vapid posts attacking another person who doesn't just love 4.0.

                            vBulletin has lost all credibility with long time customers, and a few yapping johnny-come-lately fanboys jumping up and down and kicking the veterans in the happy sacks just shows how far vbulletin.com has fallen.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by feldon23 View Post
                              vBulletin has lost all credibility with long time customers, and a few yapping johnny-come-lately fanboys jumping up and down and kicking the veterans in the happy sacks just shows how far vbulletin.com has fallen.
                              Amen to that. To the rest too actually, thinking an upgrade will go flawless is stupid, not making a working backup is amateurish.
                              It's not the fall that kills you— it's the sudden stop at the end.
                              Learn from the mistakes of others, because you can't live long enough to make them all yourself.

                              Comment


                              • Still, a vbulletin 4.0 manual ahead of release would have been nice. Where is the 4.0 manual?

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