Exactly why do we need mark up for data distribution?

[Wayne Luke]

(not to mention - most rss feed data should be replaced by with an instant messenger style deliver system to the end user)

Looks like you have a product and some programming work to do. You should get to work. Personally, I don't use RSS feeds. They take too much time when I could just go to the site in question and read the latest news and get the same information. Why load things twice?

[DirectPixel]

Looks like you have a product and some programming work to do. You should get to work. Personally, I don't use RSS feeds. They take too much time when I could just go to the site in question and read the latest news and get the same information. Why load things twice?

Changing XML delivery from a user-get to a server-push medium is quite a task.

[Zecherieh]

A serialized array is not CSV which is what I was addressing. You cannot store images in CSV. You cannot store color formatting in CSV. You can store a comma-delimited series of like values.

What happens in your serialized array if my document includes multimedia? Spreadsheets and Text documentation? Backgrounds and so forth? Other documents?

I see where you are going but developers have been trying to standardize document formats across operating systems since the late 1960s. In the 1990s they came up with XML which actually is the first cross-platform document storage system for complex documents. Even then it doesn't encapsulate the entire document into a single file which would be the ideal method.

By the Way, Microsoft documents are actually stored in a compressed serialized array in their native formats.

ok - let me rephrase the entire thing

I can see a need for XML in regards to what you speak.

I also keep using the term CSV, when I really mean delimited - and in the end - I probably would prefer a serialized array more than anything - which the only difference between that and a common csv is its basically a series of tiny csv's, delimited from each other.

I am mostly going off on content distribution - not complex document formats. Simple data - bloated beyond belief.

[DirectPixel]

ok - let me rephrase the entire thing

I can see a need for XML in regards to what you speak.

I also keep using the term CSV, when I really mean delimited - and in the end - I probably would prefer a serialized array more than anything - which the only difference between that and a common csv is its basically a series of tiny csv's, delimited from each other.

I am mostly going off on content distribution - not complex document formats. Simple data - bloated beyond belief.

Well, the perhaps in your case CSV is the best way to go.

All content is different. If you're looking to deliver complex documents, perhaps XML is the way to go. If you're looking at simple data with minimal bloat, then perhaps CSV is the best solution for you.

There isn't anybody out there saying you must use XML or CSV, or anything else for that matter. It is the job of the architect to choose the best technology solution to fit the problem.

[Zecherieh]

Looks like you have a product and some programming work to do.

Um - have been - for the past year - though that is just a smaller part of it all - and a part that I have not put that much time into because I need to do some stress tests and such because I do not have much a good enough knowledge of the amount of resources one, inactive, but connected user requires on a server in when connected.

[Wayne Luke]

Simple data - bloated beyond belief.

That's humans for you. Ultimately the data is not for computer consumption. It is for Human Consumption and they want more than just simple bits of text and a few links. That may be enough for you but not for most people who are more visually oriented.

The same thing can be applied to anything we make. Look at cars... Do they need all the gadgets and gizmos? No, but they appeal to human nature.

If you think you can build a better mousetrap, then build it and show it off. Maybe people will like it but only as long as it still gives them the comforts they are used to.

[Zecherieh]

This is a perfect example - since they have both

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.xml = 136K

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.csv = 29K

Same exact Data

[Wayne Luke]

Changing XML delivery from a user-get to a server-push medium is quite a task.

Not really. Just need to change the client to a listener and have the server publish its results on an occasional basis. When it republishes, it sends a notice to the client to retrieve the new data.

[Zecherieh]

(and the really ironic part is - since excel takes over on the CSV - the CSV data is way more readable than the XML data )

[Wayne Luke]

This is a perfect example - since they have both

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.xml = 136K

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.csv = 29K

Same exact Data

And I can read the first in my brower and the second requires yet another application.

The first I can load, press CTRL-F and find what I want. No problem.

The second, I have to load into Excel, format so it is readable, then search for what I want. Then what happens if the person doesn't have a spreadsheet program?

[DirectPixel]

This is a perfect example - since they have both

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.xml = 136K

http://www.repole.com/sun4cast/stats/ncaa2005lines.csv = 29K

Same exact Data

Imagine if the number of fields were increased from 3 to 30, with the other 20 of those fields being numeric. And you don't have Excel installed.

[Zecherieh]

Not really. Just need to change the client to a listener and have the server publish its results on an occasional basis. When it republishes, it sends a notice to the client to retrieve the new data.

In that regards - to even avoid the listening .... this is strictly for content delivery from server to server

The party with the data can just send a ping, or a connection to a specified file on the receiver's server - which then initiates the receiver to reach out and grab the format (or not if its not something the receiver wants) - that it needs - eliminating the constant checking that goes on by the receiver -

and actually allows the receiver to get the data quicker - as they know as soon as its available - not just if its available when they check for new data every five minutes, ten minutes, 30 seconds, whatever.

[Zecherieh]

Imagine if the number of fields were increased from 3 to 30, with the other 20 of those fields being numeric. And you don't have Excel installed.

I aint gonna find anything useful with this sort of data in either regards - even now with it in Excel - its rather useless - as it is - I would just throw it into a database ...

... which when using MySQL - the code to get into the database for the CSV is going to 75 percent the connection code - then the one line to import the csv...

[Zecherieh]

I am sure that if I was more of a Visual Studio type programmer - I would love XML - Microsoft had made XML easy to use years ago - but I am not

More of a PHP kind of guy - and we aint had it so easy over the years - and now that its supposed to be easier - I am probably to stuck in my ways

[DirectPixel]

I am sure that if I was more of a Visual Studio type programmer - I would love XML - Microsoft had made XML easy to use years ago - but I am not

More of a PHP kind of guy - and we aint had it so easy over the years - and now that its supposed to be easier - I am probably to stuck in my ways

Yep, PHP's got some nice XML support built-in these days.