Boy IB3 and VBulletin sure resemble ..

[jojo85]

Originally posted by [email protected]
WOW, Ikonboard is going up in the world!

First we were accused of ripping of Boardpower, then YaBB, then UBB and now vBulletin!

I'm honoured

Yes it's a open project

[JB007]

Hey it's me , Actually I attacked vBulletin in the 'Power Unleased' Topic and mentioned that vBulletin copied UBB hacks but know I'm convinced that I was totally wrong because vBulletin added more features than UBB even in the earlier versions and some of ubb's hacks were standard features in other BBS scripts ... Now ubb hackers will try to copy the features of vB 2 . I'm sorry If i disturbed anyone in that topic.

IB 3 looks excellent , Object Oriented , fast and reliable ( but ... no script can be compared with vBulletin except .. guess? ) By the way why don't matt distribute it under the GNU/GPL ?

[jojo85]

Originally posted by JB007
Hey it's me , Actually I attacked vBulletin in the 'Power Unleased' Topic and mentioned that vBulletin copied UBB hacks but know I'm convinced that I was totally wrong because vBulletin added more features than UBB even in the earlier versions and some of ubb's hacks were standard features in other BBS scripts ... Now ubb hackers will try to copy the features of vB 2 . I'm sorry If i disturbed anyone in that topic.

IB 3 looks excellent , Object Oriented , fast and reliable ( but ... no script can be compared with vBulletin except .. guess? ) By the way why don't matt distribute it under the GNU/GPL ?

vbulletin is the king forum,IB 3 is the prince!!

[Dream]

Originally posted by JB007
Hey it's me , Actually I attacked vBulletin in the 'Power Unleased' Topic and mentioned that vBulletin copied UBB hacks but know I'm convinced that I was totally wrong because vBulletin added more features than UBB even in the earlier versions and some of ubb's hacks were standard features in other BBS scripts ... Now ubb hackers will try to copy the features of vB 2 . I'm sorry If i disturbed anyone in that topic.

what took you so long

[upperking]

Originally posted by Ed Sullivan
Actually, I don't see a problem with that. I think if anything, it's actually better that way. It will definately prevent fragmentation of the hacking community.

(Anyone who was around then,) Think back to the UBB Code Hacking Hideout fallout and creation of UBBHackers.Com. That basically split the community down the middle. For a while, it really seemed like hack production was down.

Of course, I'm not saying that the split was bad in this case -- I doubt there'd be much of a hacking scene outside of SK (for nostalgia ) if that didn't happen. Or it may have gone completely dormant until a change in management.

I think when you start cutting out other peoples ideas and limiting it to the dev guys then the hacks and ideas start slowing down.kinda like they are doing now on thier dev site. most of the hacks are old ones converted over to the new version. ..less traffic i see, its mainley the same guys posting over and over again,the place is becoming a ghost town, 17 total online users "just checked" that place used to be very busy with guests browsing and newmembers.

like i said i dont think its a good idea,but of course the developers dont like it, unless thier boards are free..for more reasons then one

[wert]

mySQL and perl/cgi

I've often been told that a perl/cgi based board can never compare speedwise to a board using php/mySQL. Any truth to this?

[Dream]

Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by wert
I've often been told that a perl/cgi based board can never compare speedwise to a board using php/mySQL. Any truth to this?

yes. the overhead perl creates isnt good for highly requested scripts. php uses a built-in module in the web server, making it less server intensive. its easier (read faster) to develop for it too. plus, php has many database modules already available.

perl is more powerful than php, or so they say, but php was designed to be easy and fast to develop web content.

edit: oh, theres mod_perl, which is a perl module for the web server, but its not so popular.

[wert]

Re: Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by Dream


perl is more powerful than php, or so they say, but php was designed to be easy and fast to develop web content.

edit: oh, theres mod_perl, which is a perl module for the web server, but its not so popular.

I thought so. It explains why Ikonboard *even the new 3.0 rev* seems so poky compared to VB and other php/mySQL boards....

[Dream]

whispers: the code is much more complex however...

[4php]

Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by wert
I've often been told that a perl/cgi based board can never compare speedwise to a board using php/mySQL. Any truth to this?

Possibly because a few of thre free php/mysql boards are horribly written.

But mod perl would have a good chance as being as fast, and can easily use mysql.

PHP isn't a cure for bade coding/design. I don't think the choice beteen PHP, mod perl, mod python, tcl is the main factor in determining the speed.

Good design is the MOST IMPORTANT part, which includes good scripting and good database design.

Im really sick of hearing that by using php or mysql means your application will run faster. Usually its said by people who have never bothered to try any languages but php or straight perl as a cgi and who only use MYsql.

Go try aolserver with tcl/adp pages, or mod python or mod tcl, theres a whole lot of other languages out there that work just as good as php. Also experimemnt with interbase, postgresql, SAP all of which are also open source.

Just because Vbulletin uses php doesn't mean its better. It's Vbulletins design itself thats important.

[wert]

Re: Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by 4php
[B]

Possibly because a few of thre free php/mysql boards are horribly written.

But mod perl would have a good chance as being as fast, and can easily use mysql.

So two apps equally well programmed using Perl/CGI and php/mySQL *could* perform equally well? From what I understand, in a well written app, pulling and putting data in a dbase like mySQL is just inherently faster. Is this incorrect?

Im really sick of hearing that by using php or mysql means your application will run faster. Usually its said by people who have never bothered to try any languages but php or straight perl as a cgi and who only use MYsql.

How many hosts have mod_perl installed? Is it completely compatible with straight perl? I'm deciding on a language to learn and am avoiding perl 'cuz it seems slow and kinda arcane syntax-wise.... Are there some really fast, well written boards written in perl that we can check out? I mean, ikonboard is nice, but it's poky as hell...

[Mike Sullivan]

Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by wert
How many hosts have mod_perl installed?

Shared servers? Virtually none, for the fact that it makes many perl scripts not work. Like Matt Wright's, although no clue why you'd want to run one of them anyway.

I don't know how correct I am here, so correct me if I'm wrong, but mod_perl and mod_php work similarly, except PHP does automatic variable clearing/"local scoping". To code for mod_perl, you have to declare all variables as local to the script ( my($variable); IIRC). Otherwise these variables would be carried over to the next time the script is run. In PHP all variables created are only going to be used with that specific script.

mod_perl just basically requires you to code with strict on, which isn't particularly a bad thing.

[fastforward]

Re: Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by Ed Sullivan
I don't know how correct I am here, so correct me if I'm wrong, but mod_perl and mod_php work similarly, except PHP does automatic variable clearing/"local scoping". To code for mod_perl, you have to declare all variables as local to the script ( my($variable); IIRC). Otherwise these variables would be carried over to the next time the script is run. In PHP all variables created are only going to be used with that specific script.

This is true but it ensures good programming practices by making sure all variables are re-initialized, files closed etc. The 'use strict' ensures most of these problems are trapped. The -w switch should eliminate it all together. Also, if 'scoping' is used correctly, you should never run into this problem anyway.

I firmly believe if PHP had a similar feature to the Perl 'use strict', we'd see much tidier and bug free code in these free PHP apps that are churned out.

Installing mod_perl doesn't mean all cgi scripts have to use it. Scripts can even reside in the same directory and by using the Apache 'FilesMatch' directive, you can use a different handler each time.

PHP is almost *too* easy to use. It turns people into lazy programmers.

But, that's just my opinion and I'm slightly biased coz I know Perl better than PHP

[4php]

Re: Re: Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by wert

So two apps equally well programmed using Perl/CGI and php/mySQL *could* perform equally well? From what I understand, in a well written app, pulling and putting data in a dbase like mySQL is just inherently faster. Is this incorrect?

Yes they could work equally well. It all depends on the programmer. I don't think any speed difference between php and mod_perl is important and shouldn't influence your choice of which to use.

Avaiable hosting, available programmers, maintainability of code is all important to consider.

[4php]

Re: Re: Re: mySQL and perl/cgi

Originally posted by fastforward

PHP is almost *too* easy to use. It turns people into lazy programmers.

But, that's just my opinion and I'm slightly biased coz I know Perl better than PHP

I don't know perl - I only know php and tcl - and started with python.
But I totally agree - php makes it so easy to write messy, buggy code.
It also makes it easy to learn php so it's not so bad.